A hardcore image editor. Like Darktable.
Okay,
Iâve just added most of the data to the spreadsheet as of now. Will need a little tidiying to get it perfect, but Iâve5 highlighted the most popular suggestions.
Maybe kurtis would like to add it to the topic header?
May also need to edit some of the Categories, and work out what the hell i mean by Tiers
I write aware here in German, because I can express myself thus better. Hanging but the translation by Google to back.
- German -
Ist es nicht der falsche Weg zu ĂŒberlegen was sich ein Jeder fĂŒr Haiku wĂŒnscht?
Vielmehr wĂ€re es doch der richtige Weg fest zu legen fĂŒr welche Zielgruppe Haiku letztendlich gedacht ist. Und dann, auf dieser Grundlage basierend, kann man, bzw. muss man ĂŒberlegen, was benötigt wird um das System fĂŒr die festgelegte Zielgruppe attraktiv zu machen. Letztendlich ist Haiku nur ein System und alles Andere ist Sache derer die Haiku verwenden möchten. Also die Zielgruppe.
Da es diese Festlegung aber bisher nicht wirklich gibt, ist die Diskussion verlorene LiebesmĂŒhe.
Sollten man sich z.B. (wenn auch sehr unwahrscheinlich) fĂŒr die Zielgruppe âSpielerâ entscheiden, muss der Support des Systems auf diese Richtung fokussiert werden. Hier wĂ€re dann vermutlich der Schwerpunkt des Supports auf Treiber gerichtet.
Bei âHeimanwendernâ die das System fĂŒr einfache âHaushalts/Freizeitâ TĂ€tigkeiten verwenden wĂŒrden, mĂŒsste der Support in Richtung Office, Internet, Video und Foto ausgerichtet werden.
Dabei ist aber nicht gemeint das die Entwickler des Systems fĂŒr eine entsprechende Lösung sorgen mĂŒssten, nein, Sie mĂŒssten nur dafĂŒr Sorge tragen, dass man solche benötigten Anwendungen fĂŒr das System entwickeln kann.
Die derzeitige Zielgruppe ist, und wird es wohl auch noch lange bleiben, die Entwickler. Daher muss der Support derzeit auf diese Zielgruppe ausgerichtet sein. Dies bedeutet das binden von Neuen, wie Alten Entwicklern. Vorhandene und neue Programmiersprachen unterstĂŒtzen. Und wie bei den Spielern, hier auch die Treiber.
AuĂerdem sollte man das Paketmanagement vermehrt fokussieren, denn alles baut letztendlich darauf auf, denn ohne dieses System kann kein Nutzer Programme installieren, da es momentan keine andere Quelle von 100% lauffĂ€higen Programmen zur VerfĂŒgung hat. Ein erster Schritt könnte z.B. sein das man in jedem Haiku Build automatisch alles verfĂŒgbaren Repository Server einpflegt.
Dazu ein Beispiel: Wenn ich z.B. von der leicht zu erlernenden Programmiersprache yab fĂŒr Haiku gehört habe und mir dieses momentan ĂŒber HaikuDepot installiere, steht dieser vor einen Problem, denn die angebotene Version ist fehlerhaft. Um nun eine lauffĂ€hige Version von yab zu installieren, mĂŒsste der Nutzer vorerst den Repository Server von FatElk installieren, aber wenn man niemanden davor erzĂ€hlt wie soll er wissen von wo und wie?
- English -
Is not it the wrong way to think about what a Haiku for Everyone is looking for?
Rather, it would be the right way to lay firmly for what audience Haiku ultimately intended is. And then, based on this basis, you can, or you have to think about what is needed to make it attractive to the system for the defined target group. Ultimately Haiku only one system and everything else is a matter of those who want to use the Haiku. So the target audience.
But since it has not really gives this definition, the discussion is lost love trouble.
If you look, for example, (Though highly unlikely) for the target group âPlayersâ decide the support of the system needs to be focused on this direction. The focus of support would then presumably directed to drivers.
At âhome usersâ who would use the system activities for simple âbudget / Leisureâ, the support towards Office, Internet, video and photo would have to be aligned.
It is not meant the need to provide an appropriate solution, the developers of the system, no, you would need only ensure that you can develop such applications required for the system.
The current target audience is, and it will probably remain so for some time, the developers. Therefore, the support must currently be aimed at this target group. This means the binding of a new, as old developers. Existing and new programming languages ââsupport. And as with the players also find the driver.
You should also focus on the package management increased, because everything builds ultimately on it, because without this system can install programs no users, as it has currently no other source of 100% runnable programs. A first step could, for example, be that one in every Haiku build automatically all available Repository Server einpflegt.
Here is an example: If I, for example, yab from the easy to learn programming language have heard of Haiku and I currently install this on Haiku Depot, this is facing a problem, because the offered version is wrong. To actually install a working version of yab, the user would have to initially install the Repository Server from FatElk, but if you told anyone before how is he to know from where and how?
Greetings Lelldorin
Just two things for me⊠a reliable audio editor, and FTP that works. A third but less important app would be a web browser thatâs up to date with HTML5, etc.
Here is a similar list, but only covering native C++ software that is Open Source or shared-source freeware:
https://dev.haiku-os.org/wiki/SoftwareInfo
âIn HaikuDepotâ means that it is in one of the default binary repos (HaikuCore, HaikuPorts).
I think, there are mixed ânon-freeâ with âclosed sourceââŠ
For example: SoundPlay and Cl-amp are free (freeware) closed source software.
I would be glad to provide you NetPenguin (is a graphical FTP client which was available on BeOS)
but currently I cannot insert any url in the forum because an alert on this forum now claims that I triggered the spam filter⊠Iâm on this forum since years and I havenât done any kind of spam.
1 Like
I would be glad to provide you NetPenguin (is a graphical FTP client which was available on BeOS)[/quote]
Thereâs also FtpPositive, which Iâve been using recently and find quite convenient. (Never tried NetPenguin.) It has the slight disadvantage that the only docs seem to be in Japanese (!), but I havenât needed them â all pretty obvious (remembering that you can drag&drop in both directions). I probably picked it up from BeShare. Both it and NetPenguin are usually grabbable from there.
Are you totally blocked? Annoyingly it sometimes decides Iâm a spambot and presents a captcha, but entering that fixes things.
[quote=Pete][quote=Giova84]
Are you totally blocked? Annoyingly it sometimes decides Iâm a spambot and presents a captcha, but entering that fixes things.[/quote]
Unfortunately is a know âbugâ: see ticket 12734 on the bug tracker (I cannot also insert the link which lead to the Haiku Bug Tracker, due this silly spam filter).
Sometimes I am totally blocked, sometimes I am totally free to post any url and sometimes I am partially blocked.
A professional BASIC compiler not interpreter like
<a href="http://www.purebasic.com/>âPureBasicâ
or
<a href="https://www.xojo.com/>âXojo (formerly RealBasic)â
YAB is OK but lacks many things and there is no development anymore.
1 Like
I would be glad to provide you NetPenguin (is a graphical FTP client which was available on BeOS)[/quote]
Do you actually have NetPenguin working in Haiku? I downloaded 1.64 yesterday to see what it looked like, and it seemed to install OK (from a legacy BeOS package), but it always crashes on startup. I tried first in my PM partition, then moved it over to my older pre-PM one, but the results are much the same both places.
[quote=Pete]
Do you actually have NetPenguin working in Haiku? I downloaded 1.64 yesterday to see what it looked like, and it seemed to install OK (from a legacy BeOS package), but it always crashes on startup. I tried first in my PM partition, then moved it over to my older pre-PM one, but the results are much the same both places.[/quote]
Works pretty well for me, also on one of the latest nightly builds:
(click on the thumbnail to see the full image)
letâs see if I am currently able to post the link to the hpkg:
http://softwaredepot.altervista.org/haiku/upload/hpkg/netpenguin-1.64-3-x86_gcc2.hpkg
[quote=Giova84][quote=Pete]
Do you actually have NetPenguin working in Haiku? I downloaded 1.64 yesterday to see what it looked like, and it seemed to install OK (from a legacy BeOS package), but it always crashes on startup. [/quote]
Works pretty well for me, also on one of the latest nightly builds: [URL triggered spam filter on *me* now!!!]
[/quote]
Well, I dunno⊠Your hpkg works just fine, but no way can I get the version from the legacy package to work! Both versions are labelled 1.64_R5, but theyâre not the same. Canât tell how much differs, but at least the working version has an HVIF icon. Did you add that?
Anyway thanks for the new one. So far I think I find FtpPositive more convenient, though. For one thing I can drag&drop to and from arbitrary Tracker windows, rather than only the folders showing in NetPenguin.
I was going to say â until I got sidetracked by being âblockedâ â that itâs a pity Michael Pfeifferâs ftpfs doesnât work in Haiku. On my BeOS machine itâs great! Opens the directory on the remote machine just as if it was a local Tracker one. Donât suppose anyone has the source or contact to Michael? (:-/)
[quote=Pete]
Well, I dunno⊠Your hpkg works just fine, but no way can I get the version from the legacy package to work! Both versions are labelled 1.64_R5, but theyâre not the same. Canât tell how much differs, but at least the working version has an HVIF icon. Did you add that?
Anyway thanks for the new one. So far I think I find FtpPositive more convenient, though. For one thing I can drag&drop to and from arbitrary Tracker windows, rather than only the folders showing in NetPenguin.[/quote]
Glad that it also works, now, for you!
Anyway, if I correctly recall (I have such app since years) I âpatchedâ the binary using DiskProbe, but I canât exactly tell you what, because long time is passed.
However the best choice would definitely be the Ftp File System 
EDIT: Yes, I added the newer HVIF icon by myself.
Reading this I thought Iâd have a go at building a fuse userlandfs plugin for ftp, and have got it working 
Download here: http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=28680245751735518743
I will try and get the recipe accepted in haikuports.
You have to run it from a terminal. First start the userlandfs server:
/system/servers/userlandfs_server curlftpfs &
Then mount an ftp share with:
mount -t userlandfs -p 'curlftpfs ftp://someserver.somewhere/some/directory -o option1,option2' /local/mount/directory
So you can e.g. run:
mount -t userlandfs -p 'curlftpfs ftp://ftp.ntua.gr/mirror/BeOS' /boot/home/test/
(you have to make the /boot/home/test folder first). Then you can see the contents of the server in /boot/home/test.
The options can be from those below:
CurlFtpFS options:
-o opt,[opt...] ftp options
-v --verbose make libcurl print verbose debug
-h --help print help
-V --version print version
FTP options:
ftpfs_debug print some debugging information
transform_symlinks prepend mountpoint to absolute symlink targets
disable_epsv use PASV, without trying EPSV first (default)
enable_epsv try EPSV before reverting to PASV
skip_pasv_ip skip the IP address for PASV
ftp_port=STR use PORT with address instead of PASV
disable_eprt use PORT, without trying EPRT first
ftp_method [multicwd/singlecwd] Control CWD usage
custom_list=STR Command used to list files. Defaults to "LIST -a"
tcp_nodelay use the TCP_NODELAY option
connect_timeout=N maximum time allowed for connection in seconds
ssl enable SSL/TLS for both control and data connections
ssl_control enable SSL/TLS only for control connection
ssl_try try SSL/TLS first but connect anyway
no_verify_hostname does not verify the hostname (SSL)
no_verify_peer does not verify the peer (SSL)
cert=STR client certificate file (SSL)
cert_type=STR certificate file type (DER/PEM/ENG) (SSL)
key=STR private key file name (SSL)
key_type=STR private key file type (DER/PEM/ENG) (SSL)
pass=STR pass phrase for the private key (SSL)
engine=STR crypto engine to use (SSL)
cacert=STR file with CA certificates to verify the peer (SSL)
capath=STR CA directory to verify peer against (SSL)
ciphers=STR SSL ciphers to use (SSL)
interface=STR specify network interface/address to use
krb4=STR enable krb4 with specified security level
proxy=STR use host:port HTTP proxy
proxytunnel operate through a HTTP proxy tunnel (using CONNECT)
proxy_anyauth pick "any" proxy authentication method
proxy_basic use Basic authentication on the proxy
proxy_digest use Digest authentication on the proxy
proxy_ntlm use NTLM authentication on the proxy
httpproxy use a HTTP proxy (default)
socks4 use a SOCKS4 proxy
socks5 use a SOCKS5 proxy
user=STR set server user and password
proxy_user=STR set proxy user and password
tlsv1 use TLSv1 (SSL)
sslv3 use SSLv3 (SSL)
ipv4 resolve name to IPv4 address
ipv6 resolve name to IPv6 address
utf8 try to transfer file list with utf-8 encoding
codepage=STR set the codepage the server uses
iocharset=STR set the charset used by the client
CurlFtpFS cache options:
cache=yes|no enable/disable cache (default: yes)
cache_timeout=SECS set timeout for stat, dir, link at once
default is 10 seconds
cache_stat_timeout=SECS set stat timeout
cache_dir_timeout=SECS set dir timeout
cache_link_timeout=SECS set link timeout
Iâm not sure how stable it is, as I havenât tested it extensively. I just had a few problems and had to kill userlandfs_server. From [1] it isnât that surprising though⊠so your mileage may vary
EDIT: Seems to work ok in the terminal, but starts to fall over when you want to use tracker. Not sure what the cause of that is, perhaps tracker thinks itâs a BeFS volume (just guessing, no actual idea)?
Reading this I thought Iâd have a go at building a fuse userlandfs plugin for ftp, and have got it working :D[/quote]
That was fastâŠ!(:-)) Seems to work for me â with a few glitches.
I used Tracker windows successfully. Itâs just incredibly slow that way! Even if in the Terminal I can list the directory contents instantaneously, it takes forever to populate the Tracker window â a couple of seconds per entry. Also the Tracker doesnât show subdirectories, while a Terminal listing does. And it was quite happy for me to cd in the Terminal. Once I had a stable window, though, I could drag&drop to a local window.
I had a bit of trouble figuring out how to get to my own rPi ftp server. Finally figured out that it needed the user and password supplied (guess your example is an open ftp), unlike simple ftp which is aware of my privileged status. I had to put the options before the server name BTW, not after as in your example.
I thought unmounting was locking up, but I guess itâs just very slow too. I was about to kill things when the Terminal prompt finally returned.
Not entirely convenient yet (:-/), but a great start.
Yeah I had the same issue with tracker windows. I will have to have another look at it (Iâve exhausted my time on this for the moment). I was wondering if it thinks itâs a BeFS volume, it might be trying to read attributes, but itâs just a wild guess. It might be worth trying one of the other file managers to see how well that works.
I didnât actually try any options, handy to know the right order, thanks. I think you can also pass them to userlandfs_server.
To be clear, I didnât write this from scratch, just got curlftpfs (from here http://curlftpfs.sourceforge.net/) to build. (Reading my post back I realised I wasnât clear about that).
Here are a few Open Source BeOS FTP clients:
https://github.com/memecode/i.Ftp
They all need some TLC.