Keep in mind that we would be very lucky if the browser developers (Firefox and Chromium devs) accept our patches upstream, even luckier if they do the porting themselves.
Out of all of them, currently the Mozilla devs accept patches for Haiku support, but they won’t port it themselves. This is the same with the WebKit devs. They mention that in this ticket (0) It would be very generous and lucky for us if PaleMoon does both the work and upstream support for their browser.
However, for Chromium-related projects, they are mostly against accepting patches or supporting OSes that are not Windows, Mac and Linux. The BSDs have lots of patches (1) to maintain but would be easier if they were upstreamed, but the Chromium guys rejected them. This almost happened with me with another tool I ported to get V8 (needed for Chromium) building on Haiku (2). In the end, they accepted them due to not introducing specific OS functionality thanks to POSIX.
As for our previous V8 port (which before was broken) was rejected even at the time passed all the tests. (3), I’ll probably ask again once all the important V8 tests pass on Haiku. I hope PaleMoon is more welcoming to at least accepting patches.
They closed your issue because you opened it in the wrong place. As I have said, we should porting UXP platform to Haiku, that also make UXP based apps like PaleMoon automatically available for Haiku. UXP is here: https://github.com/MoonchildProductions/UXP Could you try to make another request on UXP’s repo? It still not want to risk asking them. As I still have to rely on them for the SunOS build of PaleMoon. Still waiting for the official release of PaleMoon on SunOS. I used to build it once on OpenIndiana, they final result is awesome compared to the builtin Firefox but my computer is too weak so it took too long, 4 hrs, to complete the build. I will never try to build in on my OpenIndiana box again!
BTW, you are pretty much lucky as the people replied you are somewhat kind. But I personally prefer to talk with Tobin, he’s straight forward. No more kind words, if he said possible, then it’s possible, if he said nope, then it’s sure they will not accept it. Dealing with him is more easier than these guys. Tobin is somewhat like Linus Torvalds, before being political corrected!
Maybe instead of trolling back and forth on the net ( see: Port PaleMoon to Haiku? ) you should spend your time with learning C/C++ so you would be able to port stuff to make the world better place and with this knowledge you won depend so much on others work.
It’s not about trolling or not! Safety first! I will not risk talking to them. When you have to depend on others to done your job you can’t risk insulting them. I’m still waiting for my SunOS official build! Let’s see how they answering you. I hope they would accept adding Haiku support but I don’t expect them to do all of the job for us, it would be an cooperation between the two community to accomplish the job.
BTW, if I could do something, I already contribute and not shamelessly depend on others to done the job for me!
Other platforms may also be able to access the stream using recent versions of Chrome or Firefox (MSE, H.264, and AAC required)
I’m now reviewing Pale Moon 28.10.0. One issue might deal with security updates (which it does have a few) and working extensions (didn’t test all of them).
Just for the record, I withdrew my post because I felt it didn’t contribute anything constructive to this already quite unconstructive discussion (in my opinion).
But let’s try:
You like Palemoon and want to get some developers interested in porting it to Haiku. That`s perfectly alright. But if they are of a different opinion you have to accept that. It’s their valuable free time that they are using to contribute to Haiku.
My personal view on the topic is that I don’t see much value in porting a fork of an old firefox version. I think the resources needed are much better invested in improving Web+ or actually porting a current version of Firefox or Chromium (the problems and pitfalls that come with that have already been discussed in several threads in the past)
So, what I’m trying to say is: Don’t get frustrated if nobody wants to port Palemoon immediately. You can at least do some preliminary work by yourself, even if you’re not a developer (check if the dependencies are met, if the build process works on Haiku etc.) and then report back to the community with specific errors or problems. I’m sure you will get help with these.
But if the developers of Palemoon are really like you describe them I would think twice about investing any time working with their software. No amount of technical excellence excuses bad personal behaviour. (again, my opinion)
EDIT: Just did a quick look around the Palemoon website, their forums and github page. Seems like a completely normal community to me. I don’t necessarily share their view on BLM but respect their right to their own opinion. I hope you have good reasons if you’re calling somebody “arrogant asshole” in public
I have deleted an overtly political post arguing about current events.
Note how @PulkoMandy expressed a personal opinion that he “would prefer to avoid people with such attitudes”, without actually saying anything about their positions and his own views. If you want to actually argue about those, do it somewhere other than this forum (and other official project channels.)
This is all surely true. Web+ may indeed still lack some important features at present but it must be easier to deal with those than to port another browser from scratch.
Two more points. What happens if Palemoon shuts up shop (as they might easily)? All that porting work will be in vain.
And a browser written specifically for Haiku must be a good thing…
First, I wanted to say sorry to the PaleMoon people and specially Tobin because of my unkind words. It’s prejudice and I’m biased. I admit I didn’t have any first hand experience with the PaleMoon developers. All of my claims above just come from this Reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/palemoon/comments/bvf0z4/why_is_pale_moon_forum_so_incredibly_toxic/ I could be wrong to believe in Reddit too much and let my unreasonable fear covered my mind as much that I didn’t dare to talk with the PaleMoon people!
Second, to be clear, I’m not in favor of BLM or I’m against it. I’m not American so it’s not my problems. But I know what pollitical correct is, though. We are here also suffered from the same pollitical correctness as you, American. To keep ourselves from troubles, we are no way but comform to it. All of my unkind words for the PaleMoon people come from the Reddit thread above, not about they shut down their Patreon. I don’t have any objections about this decision, as long as I think if PaleMoon is still works fine, it’s not a problem for me.
Third, it seemed the PaleMoon developers are more friendly than what the Reddit thread above portrayed them. As their comments here I think they are open to accept your patches: https://github.com/MoonchildProductions/UXP/issues/1599
Thank you for your interest on PaleMoon. It does have some extensions, but not as much as Firefox. Most essential extensions like block ads, translators and themes are available, though.
Yes, I’m partly agreed. Even if PaleMoon ported, it will not look as native to Haiku and well integrated as Web+. But while Web+ is not yet complete, having PaleMoon alongside of it is better than nothing.
Icecat, anyone? Not a fork! It removes the “non-free” stuff From Firefox sources code. Also referred to as GNUzilla.
The headless mode seems to be limited to a safe-mode posture and technically doesn’t need GTK to build(this is from what I have gathered personally and not exhaustive by any means).
Web+ is there. It does work, however I believe it would be easier to work on if one didn’t need to pull the source for the OS to start working on It.
I would like to work on it, myself. I would have to pull the trigger on some kind of study time to learn c/c++, API. By the way just trying to build Icecat at this point, fails out when building the “net2” portion trying to link resources to identify the MAC address. I have been looking for how address this, but have not found anything to help translate the syscalls involved.
I’m willing to work, but I know squat.
Please give assistance.
Even if Icecat removed the non-free stuffs from Firefox, it’s still Firefox! It’s the same modern Firefox and the advantage of PaleMoon over Firefox I said on my previous posts still apply!
I think you misunderstood the headless mode. I don’t know for sure, though. But openjdk-jre-headless on Linux is java without gui stuffs. If it’s the same for Icecat then what is the point of running a browser in headless mode? It doesn’t need GTK because it doesn’t have any GUI, either!
I think we should focus on UXP and PaleMoon only. When we completed the porting of them, porting modern Firefox is much more easier since they both used many common libraries (e.g: jemalloc, nspr,…). If we have one then we will easily have the other. Hope it helps!
It would be better actually if you only had to pull the source for the OS. In order to work on enhancing Web browsing, you need to clone WebKit repo, which is 8 times larger (~5GB). Then, Source/WebCore/platform/haiku and Source/WebCore/platform/graphics/haiku are of most interest.
I only want to persuade him to work on UXP and PaleMoon instead of IceCat. I tried my best to persuade people to work on UXP and PaleMoon. As PaleMoon is the only browser I’m using. Of course, he is free to do whatever he want with IceCat.