Right, but i’ve also seen as an industry the use of AI is getting less and less “thought about”. Developers slap it into their favorite IDE of choice and “let it do it’s thing”. As this stuff gets more and more integrated into workflows, the line is going to blur pretty rapidly. “oh, I forgot I had xyz enabled”
The Linux kernel even has policies for self-identifying AI assisted code at this point:
So we’ll keep doing what we’ve been doing: the honest ones will answer when we ask, the dishonest ones will try to conceal it and usually fail.
If necessary we can add a “before submitting a patch…” form for first-time or returning contributors that asks how they use “AI” to make sure they know the rules. But so far this is not necessary.
Torvalds’ stance, which forms the philosophical backbone of this new policy, is remarkably straightforward: AI is just another tool. Bad actors submitting garbage code aren’t going to read the documentation anyway, so the kernel should focus on holding human developers accountable rather than trying to police the software they run on their local machines. It’s a highly reasonable, pragmatic approach, especially when contrasted with the panic that has gripped other corners of the open-source ecosystem. (Quote from the article)
I think there are enough arguments about the problems surrounding LLMs and dismissing that as a “panic” is almost insulting imo. I would not call Torvald’s approach pragmatic but rather greedy for wanting to squeeze out more development capacities and dismissing the consequences. I don’t think we have to really follow what linux is doing.
Pattern-matching, used to copy-paste selectively, is all that AI does. The skill-set for “vibe coding” is essentially more of the long-discarded “systems analyst” role than any modern programming technique. The number one skill is debugging code that you didn’t write yourself!
Yes, completely ignoring what an amazingly succesful project does seems a very good idea.
I thought those bunch of people wanted an useable real world alternative OS, but Hey! What do I know, after all I’ve been around here for just 20 years…
I am very sceptical of ai use, and even more sceptical of the people using this without being critical enough (people just believe the hallucinations of the chatbot), but i don’t think we can completly avoid its use (and probably should not completly rule it out), just be sceptical and vigilant.
I’m not ignoring what a successful project is doing. But an amazingly successful project can still make decisions that you don’t agree on and which you can criticize.
If someone really wants to sneak in LLM generated code, they probably could. But that’s also the case with code that has incompatible licensing (i.e. sneaking in GPL code or proprietary Be code into Haiku), which is also not allowed. But simply not allowing it already deters people from doing that and gives you a basis to reject stuff that was obviously written with an LLM
Well, I certainly would like Haiku to be that (and for me at least it very nearly is already), but I do not believe that incorporating LLM-generated code will help with achieving that goal. I think that, in the long-run, including LLM-generated code is very likely to be actively detrimental to it.
But we’ve gone ‘round this argument before. 
From Linuxvox.com:
The phrase Year of the Linux Desktop was first coined in 1998 by Id Software’s Michael Tiemann. It was a prediction that a particular year would mark the widespread adoption of Linux as a mainstream desktop operating system, similar to Windows or macOS.
Twenty eight years later Linux has made almost no progress at all as a “mainstream desktop operating system”.
I’d call that a massive failure, not an amazing success.
The main problem here though is not incapability of Linux (or Unices in general) but various manufacturers and software developers (especially game developers) locking people into Windows only (since THEY are incapable). Yes, you can work your way around these lock-ins using Wine, Proton and similar tools but that’s trying to get the users something that developers/manufactures do not want them to do in the first place.
The concept of desktop is basically dead, Internet Is Linux based and 70% of the mobile phones are Linux based.
Don’t you think it’s a massively succesful project?
No.
It has succeded as a server OS for the web, but we here are concerned with desktop operating systems, where it has been a dismal failure.
The big problem was the huge waste of effort that went into profucing thousands of different distros. Had they concentrated on improving just one, and on making it usable by the non-technical man in the street, things might have been very different.
And the concept of desktop is not dead. Just because people use apps on their phones to order a pizza or make a payment shouldn’t distract you from seeing that all serious work is still done with computers. Things with proper screens and keyboards.
not trying to be rude, but 1000 of those distro’s are used worldwide and are owned by companies and communities with some of the most developed hardware that surpasses windows and haiku in terms of pure use ability and pure raw output, even with one of the most focused distro like Debian or Fedora still has hardware that surpasses a lot of windows not to mention every single distro falls into specific categories, curated to specific groups of people that being desktop, server or gaming one thing Linux can do is curate itself to be for a lot of different groups
Haiku is unified and is curated two specific group of people BeOS user or people who want a lightweight desktop that is simplistic and easy to run without any issue if you’re willing to learn the system so you really can’t compare the two as one is meant to curate to different groups of people and servers, and the other one is curated to one specific group of people
But that’s all I have to say for today I hope everybody’s having a wonderful day
Not trying to be rude but this is nonsense.
We are talking about software, not hardware. Perhaps you meant to say software, but even if you did it still doesn’t make sense.
Linux is nowhere on the desktop, which is what we are talking about.
Well, it’s used globally like windows since it’s used 100% of super computers, 77% of Web servers and damn near nearly 90% of cloud workload now we’re talking about specific metrics like it’s desktop usage then obviously it’s gonna be lower with it being lower than Chrome OS, which is built off of it
Also, I’m sorry for intruding on your conversation but all I’m trying to say in my last post is that you really can’t compare Linux to other OS
How can it be a AI kit for the data devs?
I agree with you, I was going to post a PSA on the blog section of the Haiku site. But I could probably release it here to be more appropriate.