Seeking arguments for Haiku

If I am talking with some people in whatever circle, if the topic Computers or Operating Systems come up, it would be useful to be prepared to make a little promotion/advertisement for Haiku. (Imagine for example me walking into our local hackerspace.) What would be arguments for Haiku?

I am aware so far of these:

  • open source and gratis
  • small, lean, fast
  • not as stable as Linux but more stable than most indie OSs, so for power users worth looking at
  • stylish icons, generally looking good
  • uncomplicated (in contrast to GNU/Linux)
  • can run several OS apps (Windows → Wine, Linux/Unix →own Xlib layer)
  • large parts of POSIX spec supported

(There was a discussion 2021, but it is only similar, not directly identical.

Use cases arguments for Haiku in 2021? )

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I wouldn’t mention WINE. Not because of general I-hate-Microsoft principles, but because wine on haiku sucks.

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OK, important to know.

BTW I’m asking for arguments both for tech folks and non-tech-people!

On a more positive note, write a better widget in haiku and we’ll all end up using it.

Write a better widget in MacOS and see Apple steal it

Write a better widget in Windows and … wait, why bother?

Write a better widget in Linux and see the distributions boycotting it in 3 … 2 … 1. Sure, we have our own conservative streak. But we keep the mutual death threats to an acceptable minimum.

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I think it depends some on who you talk to.

If you talk with nerds, sure, talk nerd-talk.

But if you talk to random Joe from across the street all those nerd terms just push them away. For the vast majority of all people it’s about the emotions they have with it. It’s not about being a good product. it’s about how it feels. So consider talking about feelings, and then jump on technical details only after your peer did.

Talking me as an example here: I’m surely enjoy a good talk about the pros and cons for different ways to perform context switches between userland and kernel, but what kept me here, having an open eye on Haiku for more than 16 years? It’s… the logo! I enjoy the logo design. The logo was so nice that I wanted to try the OS it represents.

Hope that helped!

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I don’t know Haiku is a good fit yet for that random Joe from across the street? ‘Cause that really depends on what Joe does on the computer.

Haiku is small, fast, highly organized and runs like a freakin’ maniac on old hardware. These are good points for anyone.

But: I’m primarily a sysadmin (or “operations engineer”) in my day job, and much of what I do on my personal computer is sysadmin-y stuff as well since I self-host everything for myself and my family.

And I choose the laptop to get for it based on what would have solid driver support in Haiku. :slight_smile:

Haiku is great for me; I can do almost everything I did on my MacBook on this laptop; I still haven’t taken the time to see if there’s a decent option on Haiku for Affinity Photo and Designer.

But I would not give a Haiku laptop to my mom; IceDove is pretty solid, but I have to work around too many issues in order to use LibreWolf for my mom to be able to handle it.

And the cursor still occasionally just jumps to the edge of the screen for no good reason.

But I would give a Haiku laptop to one of my kids, because they’re not overly habituated into any particular usage pattern and can learn to cope with some occasional oddness. (I hope.)

And a whole lot of what they want to do is web-based anyway, so a stable browser is most of it. As long as they had their old MacBook’s to keep playing Minecraft on, they’d probably be happy getting a Haiku laptop as their next “upgrade”.

Anyway, you can see how I mean it’s really individual.

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Don’t forget to mention the community. It seems nothing but rare are places where devs are accessible and people are friendly with newcomers.

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Jokingly : Are you tired of Win / Mac / Linux arguments in your tech circles? As much of a joke as it is, It’s also kind of nice to throw in the, I don’t use any of them, so I don’t care argument :slight_smile:. Albeit a sad point, I’m genuinely tired of the age old OS debates

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Then why not try a "Win / Mac / Linux / Haiku” argument next time, just for variety!

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It’s for nerds at this point, so feel free to speak to that. But the nice thing is, it enables fairly ordinary people to live the nerd life.

Always wanted to be a nerd, but don’t have the patience to get into a deep junkpile of alternative tech? You can tell your friends “sorry, my web camera doesn’t work because I’m using Haiku!” and they’ll think “wow, colossal nerd here!” Little do they know, though, how little easily you did it.

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The man on the street isn’t interested in Operating systems, so one wouldn’t come up with a good argument to try out Haiku. (we all started out here experimenting with a variaty of OS’s back in the days, and it hold the same today, the new people trying out Haiku are the ones seeking variaties).

I only have one argument when people ask me about this, my answer is simple “Why not?”, I can do everything in Haiku I want to (aside from EiD), so why would I want to run anything else.

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I think we have a new marketing slogan!

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Did anyone mention haiku DOESN’T HAVE damn disappearing widgets?

To me, this is a winning point!

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Haiku is simple, responsive, consistent and easy to use. It also respects your habits: UI does not change merely in sake of change.

Haiku design is functional: colorful icons are easy to recognise, UI elements are easy to recognise as well and provide clear affordances.

And it’s free and independent project with all good consequences of this.

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If someone ask me about Haiku, i recommend he try it for fun and learning,

for looks and usability, for cool concepts (packagefs, windowtabbing, attributes/metadata).

I would not recommend it (specially not to a non-technical person) as a daily driver at the current state, even if i use it almost daily.

The reasons are the same i dont use it as my main OS, security (rights management, running as root, missing disk encryption), missing features (Webcam Support, multiple Monitor support, 3d acceleration …)

The exception would be for very old slow hardware, where Linux is not usable

Wine in Haiku is a (very cool) tech demo atm, not a usable tool for work

This is why Haiku is still advertising itself as “beta”. Eventually we will get there, and be an OS for everyone. Until then, we already have a good product for the people with some tech knowledge and ready to go through some problems with their OS.

It looks like our competitors are consistently trying to do worse than us in that regard however. The last thing I heard is Windows broke Notepad?

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I can assure Windows broke Windows itself.

My company in 2023 provided me with a win10 laptop which was ugly (my personal taste) but snappy and efficient. Last month, due to win10 end of support, IT dept forced anyone’s laptop upgrade to win11, a nigthmare OS. 11 is heavy, bloated and even more choosy when it comes to device drivers for USB tools. Even right clicking into an Explorer window takes ages, with the horrible feature that pop up menu populates AFTER being showed - this kills usability! Further, due to CPU often pushed to 100% for no evident reason, battery life is degrading day after day.

I must admit I never liked win10, but 11 looks even worst.

Edit: sorry for the rant.

I think WINE is vital to the future of Haiku as an alternative to the commercial hell that is Windows and Apple and the mess that is Linux. And by that I means that Linux doesn’t work well unless you invest a great deal of time in it.

We need a working WINE to run the applications that will currently only work on Windows.

If we can get WINE working there is no reason why people shouldn’t ditch Windows for Haiku. And there are far more Windows users than Linux or Mac users. So they should be our target market.

Who cares? Everybody’s using Notepad++ even to open a readme file.
IMHO it is using a Bazooka against a flie but, people are using Photoshop and other beasts the same way. They absolutely want the best tool to finally achieve nothing important but bragging.
With that kind of users, I’m not surprised if M$ devs are thinking “Why even bother?”