Finally.
I would not rename OPT to WIN because I do not think Haiku should be associated with Microsoft in any way.
My suggestion is to simply use the Apple naming of CTRLOPTCOMMAND. My other alternative is CTRLALTSUPER. Either is fine.
Super key is also known as the Meta key as well.
See that doesn’t help. If you call the keys by their role names (control, option and command) instead of the names that appear on your physical keyboard keys you introduce confusion unless you understand the concept of key roles, which almost nobody does or can be expected to. If you call the key Meta or Super it is only a little bit better than calling it Option so you have to call it Win, there’s just no getting around the fact that Microsoft stamped their logo on your keyboard like it or not.
How about adapting the Apple naming? My argument for using this naming is to avoid the problem with the WIN key.
Yes, but Super is by far the most common naming outside of Windows and Apple.
Apparently there is a need to switch sides. Selecting Apple naming at least covers a significant base, while nodding to BeOS roots. PC naming scheme is not standardised anyway.
If someone’s trying out Haiku, I’m sure they are willing to-or capable of getting used to a new convention.
Meta-Super-Win; sorry, but all these names are too lame.
Is it? I’ve seen Meta key used more often than Super, but I don’t mind either way really. Meta is merely marginally better since it’s a letter shorter.
I agree.
They can be a little bit confusing… 
Apple naming does more harm than good unless you’re on an Apple keyboard. We could just rename the Windows key to Option… oh wait we already did that. See this is all to get around calling it the Windows key. Meta and Hyper and Super are all Linux terms for the same thing, to avoid using the term Windows. I’m afraid that Win is the only option because that’s what the key is named or a Windows logo but nobody wants that including Microsoft’s lawyers.
Okay, good, let’s rename Alt to Command everywhere and lock this thread.
(AltGr too)
When I plug a Windows gaming keyboard into a Macbook Pro for work (which I have done for many, many years) the Windows key is Opt. So please stop saying things with such authority that you are wrong about. I bet if someone dumped the key scan codes in macOS for a Mac keyboard with Opt and a Windows keyboard with the Windows key they would be the same. In fact I may try doing this just to check. So Haiku is not at all being weird here.
Also several of your posts have been flagged by other users here. You are being needlessly rude and know-it-all over a conversation about keyboard layouts. If this continues I or other members of the moderator team will need to take action.
Which is obviously wrong. Have you remapped (swapped) the ALT and WIN keys?
I don’t see how that is relevant to my argument. My argument is about what is typed on the respective keys and what their intended function is.
I expect nothing more from you. When feelings are hurt, you (as in moderators) love to censor! The sad thing is that you and those who report me think they are on the right side of history.
Renaming ALT into OPT would be even more confusing, as it would reuse the name currently given to the other key. So existing Haiku users and BeOS veterans get confused.
CTRL, ALT, META/SUPER/WIN/COMMAND (pick one for UI, add a longer explanation to docs) seems understandable to me and avoid the ambiguous OPT.
I would not take into consideration the current confusing situation, because then it will be even more difficult to do it right.
I vote for the Meta naming instead of win or opt, because it’s been around before windows even existed, just for this reason it deserves to be the chosen name, but also to satisfy the grudge… finally 
we can get back at MS 
.
I once found a page listing what name different software (OS and applications) use for the “win”-key. Super was the most common, and it is also what is mostly used within the keyboard enthusiast community. Unfortunately I have not been able to find that page again. Meta is as good as Super I guess. What is important is that it is not called OPT.
I was going to ask where the apple key appears when a pc keyboard is connected to a Mac, but that was already answered.
I see no problem with calling the key “win”. It is what is written in it. If we should keep grudges, “Meta” makes one remember of the facebook company. Not something everybody finds nice.
One thing that I ask is if would it be possible to allow configuration of keys names by the user. Like, I much prefer that the shortcuts for cut & paste are done with the keyboard control-C. As I do not look at the keys when typing the combination, the OS can call it anything. But having the conditions to configure in a way that suits one learned movements would be a good thing.
1 Like
Why not just rename the pc flag key to flag key? Just like the command key on apple is known as the museum key (nordics will understand) 
Also, there’s a glyph that might be usable for the flag key: ⚐
We would probably need something simpler, perhaps our own dingbats font to have a simpler shape for the flag (remove the pole). The flag has the benefit of not containing a cross like the squared plus sign, making it more neutral (short of memes about the french flag…)
If the goal is to reduce confusion of course you need to consider the current situation if you want to resolve it. And reusing an existing name to name a different key does not help but ads ambiguity.
Apart from that OPT is just not a good name for that key. Only for macOS users that makes some sense, all others are better served with ALT. And even on macOS the key has ALT as an additional label,so can be easily identified.
Actually good point, I do swap those because then the physical keyboard layout matches what I expect (Win as Opt and Alt as Cmd), in that the Windows keyboard then feels like a Mac keyboard, which is obviously what I prefer when working in that environment. Haiku just does this remapping by default, which I personally like. Having the Cmd key in the middle is just dumb no matter what the system (I think the way macOS handles Windows keyboards by default is dumb then, but I guess they did their best to make the key labels match the function.)
Overall the issue is that it is very difficult to reconcile Windows and Mac keyboards because by default the layout of Win/Opt and Alt/Cmd is swapped. BeOS did its best to find a compromise and I still think that the choice made there is decent.
The thing I hate the most is that the default keyboard shortcut for the Switcher/Twitcher to change apps is Ctrl-Tab, just so that it becomes Alt-Tab when people switch to “Windows mode.” I have been wanting to fix that forever. IMO it should always be -Tab. There is probably some hacky way to make this happen when people switch from Alt to Ctrl as the Cmd key but it might be a pain to do. Which is why I have not tried to fix that yet.