Hullo!
I was wondering how the chances are to use the upcoming new processors like the Intel Yonah aka Core Duo/Solo and their Centrino packages with Haiku. Is it on a scale like a new graphics chip or more like adding some ID strings in some header, something in-between? Will new features of that CPU “just work” or will everything require extra effort?
As you can see, I have no idea about this low-level stuff… not much about high-level stuff either, but that’s another matter. 
New processors should “Just Work”. I’m using R5 on a Centrino here. However, getting new features supported is a lot more work than that.
Hullo!I was wondering how the chances are to use the upcoming new processors like the Intel Yonah aka Core Duo/Solo and their Centrino packages with Haiku. Is it on a scale like a new graphics chip or more like adding some ID strings in some header, something in-between? Will new features of that CPU “just work” or will everything require extra effort?
As you can see, I have no idea about this low-level stuff… not much about high-level stuff either, but that’s another matter.
I don’t think it will be on the scale of making a new graphics chipset work - simply because Intel would be willing to keep their hardware specifications open to all. It would do them no good to close the specifications and reduce their market to “windows only” like graphics manufacturers choose to do.
Once good reference implementations of these new features for Linux/BSD are available, I suspect someone will bring the technology over to BeOS/Haiku in the form of drivers, etc. - but only if there is a real demand.
Thanks for your input. I guess then I can look forward to getting a new notebook next year to run R1. 
Thanks for your input. I guess then I can look forward to getting a new notebook next year to run R1. :)
You’re likely to run into most of your issues getting the video/sound/network chipsets working properly - so that’s what you should concentrate on when reviewing hardware specifications.
The bigger problem you’ll have is finding a laptop that will still issue IRQ’s the “old way” and not using the new APIC method, because only the first works with BeOS…
Oh. :shock:
That’s not too encouraging… Obstacles popping up left and right…
Well, my only hope is that some Haiku dev will see the need for modern hardware support then. With notebook sales rising every year (didn’t I read that it has surpassed the number of desktops recently?), proper support in that area seems important. Even more so as I’m personally affected here… 
I’ve been holding off buying new hardware for years now. It’s starting to itch…
Have faith. As soon as the devs get a hold of the required hardware, someone would work on it.
The problem is acquiring the appropriate hardware.
Repeat: All obstacles are surmountable!
Now, DRINK THE KOOL-AID!
:lol:
Oh. :shock: That's not too encouraging... Obstacles popping up left and right... Well, my only hope is that some Haiku dev will see the need for modern hardware support then. With notebook sales rising every year (didn't I read that it has surpassed the number of desktops recently?), proper support in that area seems important. Even more so as I'm personally affected here... :D I've been holding off buying new hardware for years now. It's starting to itch... :)
BTW, If I get what you’re saying, you want a notebook to replace your current desktop system? Meh.
Have faith. As soon as the devs get a hold of the required hardware, someone would work on it.
ChrisK: Correct. In fact, it shall replace my even slower and now also broken old notebook as well.
ChrisK: Correct. In fact, it shall replace my even slower and now also broken old notebook as well.
Okay, your choice. For almost 4 years I’ve had a notebook as well, but given the choice I’d always use a desktop system. I personally can’t stand the smaller, less vibrant displays, their fixed position, the inferior keyboards, lack of upgradability, self-servicability etc.
Notebooks look sleek at your local electronics store, but if you don’t actually need the mobility (i.e. DTR notebooks), they’re ultimately the worse option, IMO.
Ah, see, and I love to loll on the sofa or in bed and surf and chat and write. An in the summer it’s nice to sit in the shade on the patio with a cold drink in one hand and the wwworld in the other.
Anyway, I can can see where you’re coming from. Of course notebooks do have their drawbacks. Compromise, compromise. But then, I’ll still have my Dual-P2 550mhz speed demon tucked away in some corner of an abandoned room…
Okay, your choice. For almost 4 years I've had a notebook as well, but given the choice I'd always use a desktop system. I personally can't stand the smaller, less vibrant displays, their fixed position, the inferior keyboards, lack of upgradability, self-servicability etc.Notebooks look sleek at your local electronics store, but if you don’t actually need the mobility (i.e. DTR notebooks), they’re ultimately the worse option, IMO.
I agree with you, my situation is exactly the same. Take a desktop anyday. But, as I believe someone pointed out above, notebooks outsold desktops this year. If we want Haiku to be taken seriously, and used by lots of people, ignoring support for Notebook hardware isn’t an option.
Even within my house, the desktop get used for heavy building and little else, laptops do nearly everything. Can’t use a desktop in front of the TV, can’t have a desktop on the kitch table to get receipes from when cooking, can’t have a desktop in the garage/workshop with schematics on it, etc, etc.
Desktop has my TV and DSAT cards in it which the laptop can’t, but I find its still a lot easier to use a real TV and a real satellite box…
Oh. :shock: That's not too encouraging... Obstacles popping up left and right... Well, my only hope is that some Haiku dev will see the need for modern hardware support then. With notebook sales rising every year (didn't I read that it has surpassed the number of desktops recently?), proper support in that area seems important. Even more so as I'm personally affected here... :D I've been holding off buying new hardware for years now. It's starting to itch... :)
I have faith that Haiku will properly support newer hardware - eventually.
To suggest a “solution” to your problem - maybe you can invest in a good used laptop - I hate laptops, but lately people have been basically “giving” them to me - either because they’re either “broken” (one needed a new HD) or in trade for some computer work (and the laptop needed an OS reinstall anyway).
It’s a lot cheaper that way, and you can feel better knowing that the hardware is most likely supported on your favorite OS already 
So how far behind are we?
How well does BeOS handle modern multiple cpus/cores? Isn’t there a new crop of those about?
We’re not. Axel has support for just about any x86 processor you can think of. Ingo is also working on a PPC port, so most of it is already there. Dual core chips are pretty darn new tech, so I’m pretty sure that they’re not supported… yet. The SMP support in the kernel is there, but I’m not sure of its status - Axel would know better. In short, processors are one thing that all the major technologies will eventually be supported (dual core, HyperThreading, etc).
–DarkWyrm
So processor support is the last of our worries, and we should worry about the chipsets and all that other stuff?
I’d say that if we have to worry about supporting anything, it’s all about the drivers. I honestly don’t know where BeOS would be if it weren’t for Rudolf Cornelissen and Thomas Kurschel. Between those two guys, we have drivers for most of the major video cards out there. The only problem with drivers is it takes good documentation – which many companies are reluctant to provide – lots of experience, or something in-between. For an applications programmer like myself with little experience in writing drivers and little background knowledge, writing drivers seems like a black art. The nice part is that between R5 and Zeta, it shouldn’t be too hard to have someone write drivers right now which run on Haiku.
I'd say that if we have to worry about supporting anything, it's all about the drivers. I honestly don't know where BeOS would be if it weren't for Rudolf Cornelissen and Thomas Kurschel. Between those two guys, we have drivers for most of the major video cards out there. The only problem with drivers is it takes good documentation -- which many companies are reluctant to provide -- lots of experience, or something in-between. For an applications programmer like myself with little experience in writing drivers and little background knowledge, writing drivers seems like a black art. The nice part is that between R5 and Zeta, it shouldn't be too hard to have someone write drivers right now which run on Haiku.
An honourable mention has to go to Patrick for single-handedly bringing us modern wireless, too.
