KDL all the damn time

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OK, I was under the impression that Haiku was ok for limited daily use. That it was for the most part stable. Granted it is missing some software but I expected the software that is part of the default install to be basically stable. For the most part this would seem to be true… but Web+

My experience so far with Web+ has been pretty poor. First it’s slow. I can forgive that. But, it started crashing on me randomly. I entered a ticket with the crash report. These are not good because I can’t give reproduction steps to recreate the problems. The issues is. It’s random. I can go to any given page. Yahoo, Cnn, Haiku etc and it may work or it may crash. It may crash immediately or I may be in the middle of something then it crashes. But there are not “steps” I work in software QA so I understand. Reproduction steps are important. But, having random crashes is not a good user experience either.

I keep my Haiku updated. I check regularly. About 2-3 days ago I started getting KDL problems. Always when Web+ is running. Again it doesn’t seem to be anything I can reliably reproduce so there is no use in reporting it. Today, I came home from work and booted my Haiku Laptop. In the last 30min I have had 4, yes 4 KDL. Only when Web+ is running.

This make the system totally not usable for me. I can handle it missing some software. I can handle Web+ being slower than any other browser. I can handle it not being perfect. But, it is unusable for me. I have had to go to my Windows PC to type this because I can’t keep Haiku running long enough to enter in from Haiku.

My install is less than a week old.

Is anyone else having these types of issues? I am ready to just format the drive and say Haiku is just not worth the hassle.

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I found Otter Browser and it works fine for me. So, I can at least websurf. But, Web+ has got some really serious issues. Like bad issues.

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Hello. I also found Web+ a bit crashy, specially over heavy javascripts sites. However, I don’t get a complete KDL like yours. In my case, the apps just closes, and give the choice to save a debug report. But the rest of the system keep solid.

Another browser that you could try is Qupzilla.

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I get those too. The KDL thing is recent and very problematic. I discovered Otter Browser and I’m not having any problems, so far, with it. So whatever is wrong it does seem to be centered on Web+

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I primarily use QupZilla and OtterBrowser and occasional use Web+ when the other two do not load the web page correctly. I usually have QupZilla and OtterBrowser opened concurrently for banking, searches, and so forth. I have not experienced KDLs as you have.

In the mean time, I cannot wait for Falkon to be ported eventually…that should be a very good FireFox replacement.

I use Haiku daily now…so I know it’s Beta…but I am staying at my current Haiku (hrev 53379) version. I will to attempt to upgrade again to the latest; however, if I have issues again, I will revert back to hrev 53379 since that is very stable release for me.

This is the fun time for Haiku–seeing it get better everyday!

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If you could at least say which hrev you have, and which hrev you had before.

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Is Falkon actually being ported? I thought it had died?

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I also use Otter browser for the same reasons and it seems stable enough and updated.

I can say that I am using only my new Haiku laptop at home for the few things I do. And it seems very stable in general. I am using 64bit nightlies and update the system when SoftwareUpdater finds new things.

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@korli
I can post which one I have now. I can’t remember exactly which one I started with. But it was not long ago. I will check Haiku when I get home.

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@fkap
I agree. I used it for hours last night with no problems. Hopefully Web+ will get better and more stable. I do really prefer native applications.

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Yes, I also prefer native applications when I can :slight_smile:

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So, you will complain about how unstable Haiku is on the forums, but you won’t even provide a screenshot because somehow there is “no use in reporting it”? How do you expect it will ever get fixed, then?

Nightly builds are unstable and sometimes break. That’s why it’s called the “bleeding edge.” So please actually file bug reports when you hit KDLs.

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@waddlesplash

I did start logging tickets when Web+ started acting crazy. I was told, by you, that logging Web+ tickets without reproduction steps was not helpful. And provided you actually read the first post. I was asking if anyone else was having similar issues. Honestly wouldn’t you get a bit frazzled if your system dropped to KDL 4 times in less than 30min.

You know what, never mind. Haiku is wonderful, Haiku is perfect. It’s so perfect I’m going to download and install ElemenatryOS. You will never have to worry about me complaining again.

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Perhaps you misunderstood what I meant by “reproduction steps.” We don’t need a sequence of steps that always, 100% of the time, produce the bug (that would be ideal but is often not possible.)

We do, however, need at least a general description of what you were doing at the time the bug occurred; e.g. “I was browsing the web in Web+ and then this KDL happened.” Or for Web+ bugs, “I was browsing these sites and then this crash happened.”

Again, nightly builds are the bleeding edge. Stuff breaks. That’s how software development works. Why not run the beta if you want something more stable that won’t change so often?

But again, please at least give me a picture of your KDL so we can investigate it!

Of course I would. I would also then file a ticket (and since I’m a developer, start trying to fix it.) But you have only complained about it without actually providing any details at all so we cannot possibly expect to fix it. In what world does that make any sense?! The least you can do is attach a picture to your post!

We are not criticizing the fact that you are complaining. Obviously Haiku is still in beta and needs work. We are however criticizing that your complaints provide us no substance of things we can actually work on! So we want to improve, but you aren’t giving us any information we can use to improve. Can you not see how frustrating that is from our end?

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Yes, I know all this. I work in Software Development. Manual QA to be exact. Yes, it’s a boring job but I love it. That is why I did log what I did already. I try not assume what the devs will or will not want to know or need. I didn’t expect that Haiku, being this close to beta 2 would have been a bit more stable. As you can see I do limit my rant to just Web+. I was careful about that as I didn’t want to give the impression that the entire system was unstable. I came here, I vented a little and then asked if there was anyone else. The reason for that was to see if it was a wide spread issue or not. If it was wide spread then I would have started to see how we, users, could get enough data to give to devs. But, it’s like damned if I do, damned if I don’t. At this point I will just step away from Haiku. I wish you all the best but it isn’t for me.

I had found Otter Browser and even though I don’t really like it. I was content enough with it to keep using Haiku until something could be figured out about Web+. I was not even able to find anything that would help me get a KDL log, if there is one, to even enter a ticket with. That is one reason I was hoping that if it was happening to more than one person. We could get info from all our system to provide. Giving devs a good sample data to work with. But it does seem to be just me. Just my luck Then I logged in the Am and basically got slapped in the face, or so it felt.

So, again I wish everyone the best. Now, how to I delete my account here? I don’t like leaving accounts on websites I am no longer using.

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4 KDLs in 30 minutes most certainly qualifies as “the entire system is unstable.”

What does it matter if it’s widespread or not? KDLs should never happen; if they do we have a bug, and even if only one person experiences that bug, we want a record of it. Often, even if only one person experiences that bug, the fix is not hard and we’ll make it anyway. So, always open tickets for KDLs, even if you suspect they were already reported before.

As I already said multiple times: take a picture of the KDL. If we need you to collect some other information (assuming you can reproduce the KDL), we will ask for it. But usually a picture is more than enough to classify it or even determine if we’ve seen it before; and depending on the message, often enough to determine the problem and fix it.

We don’t need that much to open a ticket. One person experiences a bug = open a ticket. We’ll classify it as a duplicate, low priority, high priority, ask for more sample data, etc. Leave that to us, but actually do tell us what you are experiencing with the data we ask for.

You said this only started in the past few days. So it is possible other users will see this too, but haven’t had time to upgrade yet. Or maybe it is just you. So what? We want a picture and a ticket either way. “How many” has nothing to do with opening a ticket; it may have something to do with priority, but we always want it tracked.

You made multiple replies complaining about a KDL but then said “no use reporting it.” Again, do you not see how that is really frustrating to us?

We aren’t trying to “slap you in the face” here, we want to actually fix these bugs, but we can’t do that without reporting, and your apparent consideration of this bug as making your system unusable, but also “not worth reporting”, does not make much sense to me.

Please, don’t just complain; give us the information we request so we have a chance of actually fixing the things you are (rightfully!) complaining about!

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would be helpful to new user … how to kill active threads/programs though…

sorry nothing to do with KDL… btw…

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Can be done with Team Monitor or more finely grained ProcessController.

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Yes, but I was sure to point out that it only KDL when I was using Web+

Yes, you are correct. But as a QA person I am very fond of getting sample data. If it was just me, I would be more inclined to think something had gone wrong on my system and therefore try a reinstall before entering a ticket.

For the last time. I took this stand because when I logged a ticket without providing reproduction steps I was told that that was not helpful. So, because I could not get reliable reproduction steps I didn’t bother.

I am done. There will be no more coming from me. I can’t even log a ticket anymore as I have deleted that account.

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My guess is that these were not KDL, but app_server crashes. But I will stay away from all the useless talk here and wait for the bugreports.

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