Why Haiku?

Back in 1999 I was tired of windows and the problems it had, so I experimented with Linux and BeOs.

Linux won, because it had a more “dynamic” feel to it and I’ve used it ever since for my work (I’m a web developer).

Now today, I’m having a REALLY hard time with Linux, mostly because of the forced UI changes.

So here I am checking out Haiku with a feeling of nostalgy… I like the clean basic UI, that’s a huge plus, but I’m left to wonder: What is the spot that Haiku tries to fill in the OS market?

Can you actually do anything with it, or is it just a nice “demo” ?

All the available software seem to be dead projects or very old versions of more popular stuff from other operating systems.

Sure it’s fast, but so is my 2 months old laptop with a 10 year old linux distro, with Window Maker.

I’m trying to like Haiku, but I can’t see the light … ??!

Civilized discussion please.

I had the same exertions but coming from windows world (still there)

I still see a place for Haiku in the media and small computer world. The net PC would have been great. Also old PC older than 2 month :wink: more like 3 years :slight_smile:

Yes Linux are there but that are mostly a striped OS. Haiku don’t need to be stripped down it do has speed problems but those are known but need to have someone with the knowledge to handle.

My personal impression is that Haiku offers a purely desktop centric OS where everything needed to provide a base desktop OS is integrated top-to-bottom. This is unlike Linux desktop distros where there’s lots of difference in the userspace section of what makes up the desktop environment.

Now I actually like both approaches, I like the extreme flexibility Linux offers and I also like the top-to-bottom desktop environment integration which Haiku offers, both have their strengths and weaknesses.

Haiku’s strengths are that like previously mentioned everything which is part of what one would consider a ‘base desktop’ comes straight out of the box and are therefore well integrated rather than separate parts which may or may not fit very well together (which is largely the downside to Linux flexibility).

The biggest problem Haiku has in it’s poor software availability, this in turn is a result of it having a very hard time attracting developers which at this stage is crucial.

Now, one might think that with the huge amount of open source applications out there this would be easy to fix but in reality porting many of these ‘staple’ open source offerings like Firefox/Chrome, LibreOffice, Abiword, Inkscape, Blender, Gimp etc are not trivial, particularly due to the large amount of dependancies which are commonplace on *nix + X platforms but all need to be painstakely ported to Haiku, which is reflected in the available ports which I believe are mainly SDL based games which by comparison are extremely easy to port.

This leads to a shortage of the type of common foss applications people would expect to be available in just about any system and also severely limits Haiku’s useability as a possible day-to-day system.

But there is no simple solution, there is only so much available manpower with the necessary know-how and time to spare and the only way to improve this situation is by getting more developers aboard which again is hard due to the lack of aforementioned application availability.

Thankfully there’s Google Summer of Code which helps lure in new developers but from a project perspective they tend to be more about tackling system needs rather than application needs, which is understandable.

Looking beyond the Google Summer of Code code influx the real boon to Haiku is of course if some of these students find that they want to continue to work on Haiku once their project is complete as has been the case with some of the previous students.

There are other issues like hardware compability but in my opinion the lack of software is the big hurdle when it comes to Haiku having a wider adoption.

I’m also kind of hovering around the peripery and looking into Haiku at the moment. What I’m looking for (and what it seems likely to provide for me, once various issues are taken care of) is a full-featured free and modern OS that is desktop-oriented from the get-go; Linux is a reimplementation/upgrade of a mainframe OS from the '70s into a server OS for the 2000s, and there’s so much separation between the OS and the components of the GUI (and so many different variations of those components) that it feels very tacked-together, especially when each application uses a different widget toolkit from the last.

There’s also the matter of the underlying OS just being too damn complicated for a desktop machine; ever had to hunt down one piece of a script sequence somewhere in a folder of hundreds of scripts buried somewhere deep in the filesystem, just to find out what’s going wrong and figure out how to fix it? That kind of thing might be excusable in a server environment, but for a desktop?

>> Can you actually do anything with it, or is it just a nice “demo” ?

Of course! I would advise against using it in a production environment as it isn’t well tested. However, if you make regular backups you should be fine.

What sort of software do you use on a regular basis?

>> So here I am checking out Haiku with a feeling of nostalgy… I like the clean basic UI,

that’s a huge plus, but I’m left to wonder: What is the spot that Haiku tries to fill in
the OS market?

I don’t think it really tries to fill in any spot. There’s a ton of operating systems out there. However, I’m not by any means a leader or represent the Haiku community so maybe those who are do have a plan for it in that aspect. To me, Haiku offers a freedom of choice. While Linux is a great operating system I believe that Haiku would be a great alternative for desktop environments (as previously mentioned). Not only does it have a GUI tightly coupled with the operating system (as opposed to X), it also offers some of the power of Linux through its POSIX compatibility (I’m hoping it is, anyways) and *nix-like command-line terminal. Also, you get GCC which is the base compiler and library package used by almost everything in the Linux world.

>> Now today, I’m having a REALLY hard time with Linux, mostly because of the forced UI

changes.

Without trying to suade you away from Haiku, nobody is forcing any UI changes on you :slight_smile: Feel free to private message me if you want to rectify that problem. I’d rather avoid the topic on this forum but am definitely willing to help. For example, you can still run Gnome 2 on the latest Ubuntu. I use Gnome Shell but it tends to have a bad public image for whatever reason. However, a little bit of Googling (or DuckDuckGoing) might serve you better.

>> Back in 1999 I was tired of windows and the problems it had, so I experimented with Linux

and BeOs.

Linux won, because it had a more “dynamic” feel to it and I’ve used it ever since for my
work (I’m a web developer).

Same here!

Welcome to Haiku!

>> Of course! I would advise against using it in a production environment as it isn’t well tested. However, if you make regular backups you should be fine.

I just need an OS to run programs. All my files are on a NAS anyway :slight_smile:

>>What sort of software do you use on a regular basis?

Thinking of what I use on Linux, is Bluefish for HTML/PHP and the like, Open(Libre)Office and the common browsers, but mainly firefox for developing. I used to have Apache/Mysql and other servers running on the same machine, but now I have a dedicated server for developing.

So my needs aren’t that complicated, as I’m not a big multimedia consumer (I have an iPad as a toy for that ;).

I do run Windows 7 in VirtualBox for Adobe illustrator/photoshop and some other apps to be compatible with some of my customers thou.

>> Without trying to suade you away from Haiku, nobody is forcing any UI changes on you :slight_smile:

Thanks for the offer. I’m quite familiar with Linux on the desktop, so I know my choices. I’m happy with XFCE now, but for how long…? When Window Maker was actively developed I used to use it, and rather liked it for some weird reason :slight_smile:

I do feel right at home with Haiku :slight_smile:

Hey Pasi,

I’m one of the Haiku developers. I think the previous posts have done a good job about explaining the purpose of Haiku.

For me the most important thing is the complete top to bottom integration present in Haiku. The kernel, drivers, GUI system and applications are all designed as one to work together. Linux will never have that. Developers of various pieces of Linux can cooperate all day and make protocols to communicate and try to match GUI styles and more and more, but they can never get as integrated as Haiku. Linux is probably my second favorite OS (after Haiku) so I am by no means a Linux hater, but I think anyone who uses Linux can admit to what I’m arguing here.

Further even Windows and Mac OS X have legacies which prevent the same sort of consistency and integration you can get with Haiku (though obviously these days not too many Mac developers are using Carbon, the legacy API.) Windows will get even worse with Windows 8 from what I have seen, where part of it will use the Metro interface and other parts the “classic” interface. I think Windows 8 will be a Vista-level disaster (or worse) for Microsoft (even though personally I like some of the Metro design elements, but consistency is key.) Apple is trying to turn Mac OS X into iOS, and while aspects of that are smart, I think in the end we will just have a majorly dumbed down desktop OS.

Of course Haiku has its own legacy in BeOS, but fortunately BeOS was a very nicely designed system (and even people who don’t like Haiku now would probably agree to that.)

Based on your last post, I think Haiku could be a great fit for you. Having a dedicated NAS for files and a dedicated MySQL server for web development would definitely make your life a bit easier with Haiku. I’m also a web developer as my day job (Ruby on Rails mainly), and you give me an idea of one less piece of software I might need to port to Haiku to do Ruby on Rails development (that being MySQL since it can have its own Linux server.)

Of course with all the above said, Haiku certainly has many more things it needs, and we do have a lack of applications as you noticed. Fortunately we also have the BeOS legacy in that sense and there are many decent BeOS applications which have been open sourced that just need a little bit of love to be updated and work nicely in Haiku. But that will take developer time, which right now is probably the most scarce resource for Haiku (and frankly for much of the world.)

Once dubbed the “Multimedia OS” there’s still many things that stand out. Running 3-4 soft synth’s at once is no problem on an average system, in fact I can run 2 at full polyphony and CD quality on a 1995 single core laptop. I can record the mixed output into a stream, adding external mic’s or guitar pickups without worrying for latency.
In that aspect, Haiku is definitely filling a spot in terms of creative enablement where other OS’s are just enabling consumption of digital content.
That, beside it’s immediate response to any user action is what makes Haiku special to me.