…all over the place fixing and improving things in the project. Look at the commits.
Do you think that somehow with putting a label “R1” on a release we’re all going to somehow get full-blown commercial support for this thing? What do you think is going to realistically happen?
No. I have never stated such a thing. R1 is not just a label, it is a stable platform.
It will attract users and some of them will start to develop on or for Haiku, improving the system and its ecosystem which will further attract users and the cycle continues.
Please do explain further how having R1 of a relatively niche operating system would attract users and developers, especially if it still doesn’t work on their computers due to unsupported hardware,
I am so sorry, your question just hit me that I have been wrong all the time. Never releasing a stable system and continuing to break functionality will attract users, and developers wants to write software that constantly breaks. That just makes sense!
Haiku will always have unsupported hardware because it is a moving target. That is an unsolvable problem. It can be minimized but that requires more developers. And Haiku will attract more developers by never releasing a final stable release that will constantly break because of new functionality that is not compatible with existing drivers.
None of the changes required there require the BeOS source code.
Rewriting the Be Book would be cheaper than buying the licence for it.
You can’t rewrite the BeBook because they have the license.
Anyone can write API documentation for anyones API.
Sorry but you are not standing on the ground of reality -
You - and some other member here - wants to force their vision and imagination of an imaginary Haiku to the real existing Haiku … Haiku which is a project actually.
Haiku is a project … not a startup !..
The difference is that :
there are no financial investors of the market here but faithful users and believers who are capable to donate
→ with their money – Haiku users (and maybe devs also)
→ with their work (coding/docs writing/ticket handling) – Haiku and app developers
→ with their translation activities – both groups (especially as all devs also users of Haiku as well)
this project.
You want to haul Haiku up for something that’s not in its area. It was not funded as a startup to be finally a product or a successful enterprise.
It was founded – by founders – for not letting the essence of their beloved BeOS go into waste or fade away. They wanted to create an alternative for the future and also they had put a solid base for an effort to re-create it on an open source basis. They were not targeted to sell a product or lead in to the market. They just wanted to keep and share with others who would use it as well.
Moreover the project had evolved - mostly on x86 and x86_64 - so now it is far more capable in HW/SW support than BeOS was…
This way very false if some of you still try to set up the Haiku project as it is stil some remaining of an old legacy OS blablabla … what we know very well it is just a simple lie, a misstatement or lack of real knowledge of today Haiku.
We - others here – we feel very sorry for you as you are
not fully satisfied
or
not satisfied at all
as how Haiku are now … but we use it as we can do and for that it is already capable now.
There are some of us who are capable to evolve/fix Haiku itself and/or programs/applications running on it.
Most of us relates to each others with respect an patience - respecting their personality and knowledge and efforts they can do put in the Haiku project
We expect that you are all adults - means you can make decisions and then can leave with it. I beg for pardon for teenager users/coders here.
This way were offered if you are not satisfied
→ help in Haiku project with above detailed supporting activities
→ create an own version
→ or not use it … if its usage as is or slowness of its progress makes frustration in you.
On progress I mean anything that usually cause disturbace in the members here who compose such urging critics.
We can identify them as always debates but never show up some real example and/or as really doing something … but talk
(ok exactly write the stuff 'cause it’s a forum - you all know what/how I mean).
If you are adults it should not hurt you as these offers are honorable and not done for insulting / hurting you but these are the reasonable choices.
So please See Haiku as it is - a successful project. Not a product.
Especially not for everyone. Many people use their system what they use as they do not want to learn new - they just want to use what they know well and can use/manage.
They won’t use it Haiku - anyhow you propagate the opposite –
just about the existence of a mentioned missing service/program should added/ported and also a plus target HW platforn supported finally. They just want the OS itself as well to
look like and work like what they use actually.
Against you – they do not like or hate OS or computer systems - they just use it : they will remain on Windows , macOS, Linux anything … even on old computers, or unsupported OSes … just because they want to use it as they can handle and they are comfortable there.
Haiku would be a new place – where they must learn again - even the ported software, even the available service, etc.
Otherwise - if you want to continue your empty debates …
… it is better if rather all of you put together your efforts …
and start an own Haiku as a startup and finally step up as role models …
executing your dreams … there.
Then expect what you can expect from such phenomenon you haul the Haiku project up for in long essays for devs.
I find it ironic that you wrote a massive post telling me I should not ventilate my criticism in a post that is criticism against me. That is the definition of hypocrisy.
“All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others.”
Then enjoy it, sir, I mean your finding and intellectual superiority ( if any ).
I wrote everything that I wanted. Any other supplemental is meaningless, indeed -
Let me address this. I am not forcing anything on anybody. I am only stating my opinions. Feel free to ignore me, it is that simple.
Yes, we can write a Haiku book, and we have.
But we cannot incorporate BeBook’s contents, or modify BeBook itself.
So the Haiku book will eventually obsolete the bebook once all information is available.
A little question, to maybe make this whole thread a little bit useful and constructive :
As of now, should the Haiku Book be considered additional to the Be Book, or should it be taken as complete ? Like, if one wants to understand the workings of some parte of the OS, or how to code something, should this person study both books, or only the Haiku Book would be enough ?
You’d first read the Haiku book, and if that is incomplete or unclear than read the BeBook, and then the actuall sourcecode.
(If the Haiku book is found to be unclear in some aspects it is a good idea to then see if one can update the documentation in that regard)
Technically they are ports.
I think what @pvalue is referring to is software originally written for Haiku.
Let’s take an example. Do you know Zello? It’s an application that turns a phone into a walki talkie. It is widely used in logistics companies. Imagine creating such an application, but for Haiku. In this case it would be a dispatcher. You know, to manage messages between different carriers.
Obviously, right now Haiku is not mature enough to be used in a large enterprise environment, such as a logistics company. But it could be used in small companies. A good example of this would be to create a small application to manage a small store: manage the warehouse, make inventories, print customer invoices…
I think the state of haiku is quite good, actually.
What is missing?
For ME it is:
Back in the 90’s - mid 2000’s, maybe. Nowadays, this is all platform agnostic stuff generally done via a web based interface. As such - there is nothing Haiku can offer. For inventory, hand held devices with barcode readers are pretty normal. These are either going to be in a phone or small tablet form factor running Android, iOS, Linux or an custom embedded OS. Developing this type of stuff in a full desktop OS SDK would be absolute overkill - way more likely to be React Native, Flutter or something like that - platform agnostic. I do Android dev and there is pretty much nothing you can’t make an Android phone do these days - even just using stock hardware. But with BLE/Bluetooth and USB-C you can pretty much connect to anything.
I don’t know.
Layers and layers of web technology to do a simple task.
Would a bloated application come out?
I’d rather use Kexi to make forms visually, and create a small, fast, and specific application.
Everything else is making it bloated.
That’s precisely the Haiku philosophy, fast, small, optimized, simple…