ARM yes, SBC definitely, RPi ... maybe not


#61

Much of the current SoC and USFF consumer models fit within current Haiku capabilities. As for the IGP, you have the baseline specs of OpenCL 2.x and OpenGL ES 3.2.

I compared a few media streaming sticks and USFF models. At $29 USD, I had 500,000 media channels with 4K video/HDR10, web browsing, etc.

There are the many variables to this, but it is highly possible to fit Haiku on very small devices with adequate RAM, high-end video graphics, and storage capabilities at a very decent price,


#62

Except 99% of SoCs ship with binary driveres which are useless outside of android… there are some hacks to get it to work on Linux also, and Barret was taking this direction with his V/OS … but it’s compeltely impractical to port Haiku to ARM and also expect accelerated graphics at this point especially as ARM is just a fast moving target and barely has any standardization at all especially among SoCs.

There are only 2 maybe 3 mostly incomplete open source graphics drivers that might even potentially come close to having enough documentation to make it work with alot of effort and that is the freedreno and mali drivers, maybe etnaviv also. These drivers lag way behind as well as the vendors don’t comtribute to them… much like the other open source drivers did 15 years ago the ecosystem just isn’t ready.


#63

Once again (sorry that I picked ARM an example, I have a bit of a boner for ARM as it’s part of my own distant past when RISC was still a pretty neat idea). IIRC even Intel and AMD boxes all run RISC internally at the microcode level but have a translator which converts from CISC to RISC so we get the speed of RISC with the compatibility of i386//X64.

This isn’t about the metal we’re running on so much as it is about giving Haiku a place it can call home.

A CHEAP place. An appliance place. A place where it can flourish as the OS of choice because it IS so darn good for daily computing. Somewhere it can truly shine rather than been some sort of also-ran that is a necroed version of BeOS.

I feel for BeOS - Gates and Microsoft crushed it anti-competitively as he and Balmer and whoever else is there these days are wont to do. The same happend with Lindows (I bought that too).

Microsoft only saved Apple because if it hadn’t the regulators would have come down on it like the sword of Damocles - something they ought to be doing to Facebook and Google now actually (but that it another thing.)

Consumers deserve choice.

Android is Linux without the GNU - and a huge piece of spyware that people still seem enamored with beyond anything I can comprehend. Maybe it’s because I remember a time before Google/Facebook/Amazon realised what machines could steal. A time when you switched a computer on and it came ON - it didn’t boot for 5-10-30 seconds (or minutes in some cases.)

You hit the switch and “pop”

BBC Basic © Acorn 1981

(Or whatever, I forget, it’s been a long time since I switched an Acorn machine on and the only assembler I can recall is LDA, STA and a few conditional branches. Oh and multiply/divide by shifting and bit of twos complement. Great days, not.)

Yes I really AM that old and yes I really could program in assembler. In fact, I could program in a bunch of languages - except the one that mattered, C!

Computers were appliances. They were hobbyist appliances by and large but still appliances. IBM PCs and clones were in offices as they still are now but even those things loaded with a modicum of speed (and a hard drive that you could SMART test by listening to it.)

I’m seeing a lot of “Negativity” in this thread (sorry, but it’s there). This is about as much use as Greta Thurnberg telling us that climate change is a problem. No s**t Sherlock!

It’s easy to knock something down, it’s easy to bitch about it and some people become memes by doing just that. Building something (like Haiku itself) takes a huge amount of thought and a hell of a lot of effort. Not to mention expertise.

I want to see a Haiku “stick” or a Haiku “box”. An appliance built upon this wonderful OS - an OS that has been designed to be beautiful rather than glued together with all the charm, forethought and preparation of a shart - yes Linux, I’m looking at you.

Why else would people want to run it? How else is public at large supposed to hear about it? It doesn’t have a killer app (and likely never will). Things are different from my day. We’ve moved on but some things never change. I never thought we’d see a desktop Linux never mind BSD - and yet I have both on the machine in front of me! (Both, this is the Void Linux one) run custom versions of XFCE.

I’d be better of in many respects running Windows because I have some Windows only apps that don’t (really don’t) work on WINE - and might never do. Apps - not games.

That’s crushing because the Linux versions just don’t do it as well which means I have to fire up the workstation just to do some specialist photo work, DTP and a few other oddities.

I’d rather use Haiku to free myself from the tyranny of Microsoft and other parties who now control the direction of Linux and much as I like *BSD, oh my LIFE it’s slow to boot!

I just want a machine I can flick on, write and email and flick off. No mess, no fuss, no signin… a machine that I can slip in my pocket and plug into an HDMI port… you know like the Intel compute stick - Atom based, doesn’t run Haiku… thanks to being Microscuppered.

Haiku is good, damn good, but no one in their right mind is going to blow 2, 3, 400 bucks or more on a machine that doesn’t come with a familiar Windows or Google virus. Baby Duck syndrome has a lot to answer for.

SBCs on the other hand… those are still ripe for the picking. IoT is probably going to get really popular too - we already have smart … things (if you’re prepared to sign away our privacy to Google/Amazon for your shiny gadget.)

What about a tablet? Oh wait… that’s bloody ARM again isn’t it. And oh look, Google has its grubby hands all over that too.

But again, this is somewhere Haiku (a touch version of course) could absolutely shine. That’s a lot to ask from the developers, I know, but software is useless without hardware and the current crop of software is dictating what hardware we can get our grubby mittens on.

That means either low-power X86 like Atom or ARM (ugh) although I believe there are a few boards like the Lime 2 which have completely open sourced the hard and software. I could be wrong of course.

The Freedombox project is working on this…

AND there - right there - is a project that is crying out for a good desktop complement. It’s a micro-server already but there’s no real desktop except Raspbian which is pretty “meh” if we’re honest and still has Microsoft and other closed-source vendors pulling distant strings.

Rant, rant…

So please, can we can the “we can’t because…” comments and try to be a bit more productive? Come on folks - all this “can’t” talk isn’t getting us anywhere. This was a battle cry for solutions! Let’s give Haiku to the masses!


#64

Don’t stop… believing. Fit Haiku on compatible hardware. That’s it.
If not, get or write/port drivers for it. I have Haiku on USFF/SFF-solutions and use 2D/3D without accelerated graphics. Protrekker and other sound tools for music/audio. Didn’t cost millions.

Look at the HCL and build it from there… :sunglasses: